3 of my friends work for Deffenbaugh. If it became a single service the city should definitely use Deffenbaugh. I would hate to see that happen though because of the many smaller companies would have to give up their businesses. That wouldn't be good.

I don't and didn't like the service I got from Deffenbaugh and found my own trash service.They have better rates and much better service.I have used them for a few years now. I should have ,and keep, my right to use the service that works best for me and not be forced to use Deffenbaugh because someone else like them. I pay for it, it should be my choice.

If St. Joe could start a municipal trash service that would include recycling, I would be all for it. Some small businesses may go out of business, but that doesn't mean they would necessarily be unemployed. If there is currently a demand for a certain number of trash haulers, then that demand would stay the same, even if they consolidate. Even if they divided the city into sections (like Savannah did) and let the trash haulers each take a certain section it would be better. Everyone complains about the price of gas (which is driven by demand), but no one wants to consolidate trash services so you don't have 4 trucks a day in your neighborhood every single day?! As far as service goes, they are picking up your trash and sending you a bill - how could the service be so bad? Do they not put the lid back on your trash can or something? I use RSP and I think they are fantastic. They've even knocked on my door to remind me that I forgot to put my trash out. But if I could pay one bill with my utilities and help out the environment by recycling and cutting down on the number of trucks in my neighborhood, I say go for it. As a side note, it would be nice if it were part of our utilities so the people with 400 bags of trash sitting in their back yards or on their front porches would be forced to pay for a service so their garbage wouldn't draw vermin.

I agree with njones60.

Nice post NJones! You make a couple of solid points. Deffenbaugh's customer service is terrible. Coincidentally (even though my friends work there) I use Keep It Clean. Their customer service is garbage like the stuff they pick up. The lady on the phone is an absolute you know what. Thats not what we're her to discuss though.

You make an excellent point on the people with lots of trash issue. It's attached to their utilities so they are going to pay it (unless they are idiots). That means their trash will be picked up.

I am on both sides of this. My friends would have a job either way. The smaller guys (you know, the one's that use an old chevy with wood brackets in the back of their truck) would go out of business and the three major companies, Keep it Clean, Deffenbaugh, and RSP would continue service through city contracts. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. How many little guys are there? Oh and I forgot ABC, which happens to have actual garbage trucks. I dunno.

I think I have encountered the same customer non-service person at the "D-word," which is why I switched some time ago.

Yes, there are many more households in St. Joseph than in Savannah, but city-managed recycling would be a great idea. When I lived in another state, the town (admittedly, in a very well-to-do part of the country) provided a recylcing bin to each household and picked it up curbside once a week, no charge. It was a city service just like police and fire. That way, we could all still choose our own waste collection company.

As for those who choose to keep garbage museums or critter condos on their property, Code Enforcement needs to take an active role.

What I especially appreciate is to be awakened at 4:30 or 5am by those loud trucks.

I use United Waste and they are terrific!!! If we are out of town, our trash man gets our trash from next to our garage for us. And he puts the trash can lid back on and puts the trash can over halfway up in our driveway each week.

I would hate to see Deffenbaugh be the only show in town. I can tell when it is Deffenbaugh trash day in our neighborhood because they always leave stuff on the ground and there are always trash cans thrown down in the street.

I think there needs to be something done, but who knows when the city will get something worked out.

Jayhawkbabe makes the most interesting comment about Deffenbaugh thus far...

With as large as they are, they retain the vast majority of commercial accounts. I have several friends who own their own businesses, and I know a handfull of folks who manage property and employ their services.

It never fails, ALWAYS leaving a huge mess like a trail of cookie crumbs. I understand it may be a difficult task but... isn't that your job? Streamline services and increase efficiency and profits? They're definitely seeing profits. I'm guessing their fuel costs to be in the $20K/month easily. A MONTH.

Would be nice to see it taken care of at the municipal level, though. I've been to places where it's maintained by the local government and you can tell.

I think 'momswisher' has it right here.

For those who dislike any particular company's customer service, business policies, etc., the answer is always free market competition. Consumers will always be best served when they have the freedom of choice. Only competition can force companies to keep their prices down and adhere to good business practices. Businesses that do not strive to keep their costs down and keep customers happy will fail. A lack of competition is *never* in the best interests of the consumer.

Those of you who advocate a single provider (mandated by the city) do not even agree on which provider you'd prefer. Nor are many of you considering the implications of the forced closure of businesses which have been providing an essential service to their communities for, in some cases, decades. 'NJones' comment, "Some small businesses may go out of business, but that doesn't mean they would necessarily be unemployed," is, no offense, preposterous. Unemployed they would certainly be, sir! The city should no more mandate a company's monopoly on trash collection than it should declare a company's monopoly in any other market; would you be happy if you were forced to use a particular grocery store or gas station? Remember when Southwestern Bell was virtually the only company which provided home phone service? How wonderful was that? How about Aquila? Unless consumers have the choice to do business elsewhere, there is absolutely no incentive for the company in control to operate according to the consumer's wishes.

I understand the sentiment that trash trucks are "loud" and that they use "too much gas" and that there are too many of them. But these simple inconveniences are by no means so severe that they require such drastic market intervention. The inconveniences that would result from such intervention would be far worse. Only competition in the market can force trash companies to use their time and resources more efficiently, gas included. To those who are horribly bothered by the sound of trash trucks, might I suggest increased insulation on one's house? Certainly we ought not distort the market and punish the consumer because a few people are upset over a little noise?! We are all free to migrate to less populated, less trafficked neighborhoods. The action some are demanding here seems entirely disproportionate to the level of "inconvenience" that is being reported.

As for recycling, if enough people in the community demand recycling services, the market will provide them. The company to pioneer these services would be rewarded with an increased customer base, and other companies would follow or lose their competitive edge. There simply is no problem that the market, free of intervention, can not overcome.

Be careful what you wish for, my friends. You just might get it!

I am a former St. Joe resident who now lives in Kansas City. I've used various trash haulers in the past while living there and while I am for a free market, there are WAY too many trash disposal companies operating in a city of St.Joe's size. My service is included with my city services... we get two, tied up bags of trash a week that can weigh up to 40 lbs. (not ripped/stuff falling out of them). Above the two bags, residents can purchase "bag tags" for $1 for each that you put on each additional bag from several local stores. You are also given one or two blue containers for recycling. The first truck comes by on a scheduled day for your neighborhood and picks up the trash bags..this is typically between 7:30-8:00 am. The second truck is the one that picks up recycling about an hour later. Works like clockwork, the trucks aren't excessively loud and aren't in my neighborhood at 5am. Runs very smoothly. I think at the very least, the city should consider no more than 3 haulers who would also provide recycling services. I understand people are trying to support families, but I can't imagine any of the 18 haulers is making a ton of money...there are only so many households to service and with the cost of gas, expanding their areas would be costly.

Hey chooseliberty, I see you conveniently left off the FOUR-THIRTY - FIVE A.M part of my noise complaint.

Then you suggest I possibly "migrate" (huh? drugs?) to less populated/trafficked areas.

Why didn't you suggest I adjust my life/job/sleeping hours to accommodate them, in keeping with your logic?

Here's a better idea. Have trash collectors observe the 7 am noise curfew in residential areas.

I would be interested to know which trash collectors are out at 4:30 am. I'm guessing it is the bigger handlers and not the small providers.

I lived in another state for many years and the only way you were able to get your trashed picked up was with paying your water bill.

One town I lived in would take out bids for one company to do the work.

I am usually for the underdog in most situations. This is not one of them.

I believe if St. Joe gave the concept of having only one trash service a chance they wouldn't mind it so much.

As for trash services in this town. I have tried the little guy and all I got was a driveway full of trash and broken glass. I now have Deffenbaugh for my service and am very pleased. I have talked to that lady who answers the phone. Even though she is pretty abrupt, I have had no problems with her either.

I would definitely prefer choosing my own trash service. Actually we do have a trash hauler using a pick up, and they are the best trash service we have ever had. Very kind, very accomadating, and very reasonable (and doesn't even mind that extra bag every now and again). Defenbaugh was too high, and ABC must have hired that same rude lady from Defenbaugh. Nah, I think I prefer to pick my own trash service and stick with the nice folks we currently have.

Frank, there is no need to take offense, sir. If a company is violating a noise ordinance, you have every right to report it. If the ordinance doesn't apply, yet you feel it should be adjusted to apply, you have a right to pursue that change via the proper means. Have you done so?

You also have the right to boycott that company and tell your friends to do so. And yes, you have the right to live out in the country if you do not enjoy the inevitable noise that comes from living in the city, should you be dissatisfied with the city's response to your noise complaints. My comments were not an attack on anyone personally; such is the nature of debate. Personally, I live next to a highway. Sometimes I am awakened by the noise; not once, however, has it crossed my mind to attempt to limit highway traffic during my sleeping hours via force of law. (An imperfect example, but hopefully understandable.) Should the trash collectors change their hours to accommodate your schedule, they would inevitably be disturbing someone else's. Night workers?

My point was, and is, that the nature of your complaint was not enough in and of itself to justify a complete overhaul of the system of competitive local trash collection -- an overhaul which would leave many unemployed. The complaints regarding the service of the various major trash companies underscore the point that competition is important. What happens, sir, if the company to which the monopoly of municipal trash collection is bestowed decides to run *all* their trucks at 4:30 a.m.? Would you be any better off? It is important to evaluate these matters from multiple perspectives rather than limiting ourselves to only an egocentric point of view. We're talking about a major policy shift here; many local residents will be affected either way. (Not calling anyone egocentric, by the way, lest my comments be misconstrued.)

As for my use of the term "migrate," the word is principally defined as "to go from one country, region, or place to another." "Traffic," sir, is "the passage of people or vehicles along routes of transportation." How you managed to relate drugs to such a comment is beyond my comprehension.

Actually I would guess the smaller trash companies are the one's doing 4:30-5am pickups...I'd almost guarantee that some of these smaller guys have other day jobs to get to by 8am so they are running their routes between 4:30-7am in order to get this done. There is no way with 18 haulers in a city with 70,000 that they are all busy 5-6 hrs a day picking up trash...they all can't make a decent living on this alone. I agree with one poster...no company should be allowed to pick up that early in the morning. At the very least they should not be allowed to pickup before 6am week days and 8am on weekends. They aren't all working 10 hr days picking up trash.

looks like if there were another referendum today it might be a close call. i am all for competition but a city the size of st joseph needs a recycling program. in addition, having a garbage fee added onto the sewer/water bill would provide every household with garbage service. perhaps then there wouldn't be quite as many houses with mountains of trash stacked up in their back yards.

chooseliberty - Municipal trash service and Aquila differ in at least one significant way. The city would contract out trash service. We have no choices when it comes to electric service, but if we were unhappy with a city contractor, we have a remedy. The city can mandate certain contractual requirements that, if not met, can result in the cancellation of the contract. Competing for a contract forces a company to keep prices low and offer better customer service. I'm not advocating for any one trash collector, and I don't necessarily believe there should only be one, I just think that by streamlining the service, we can save money and help the economy. I see your point that better customer service comes from a free market economy (although from some of these comments, that doesn't seem to hold true for Deffenbaugh!), and I typically agree with it. I always try to shop "the little guy" when I can. I just believe there are too many advantages to contracting the service through the city to not consider it. I stand by my comment stating that most trash haulers would still have a job. If there is currently a demand for 100 trash haulers for a city of 70,000, that won't change if it is contracted through the city. If XYZ company gets the contract and only has 50 employees, they will have to hire more to meet their requirements. I understand that some people may lose their jobs, but I don't think it will be this huge unemployment that people are suggesting.

I'm just thinking though if it goes through the city, then any customize service that the smaller guys tend to do will go bye-bye. I know when my elderly parents could only manage to get the trash just out the front door instead of curbside, they would accomodate and help them out by getting it at the door front. I doubt Defenabugh or any of the bigger companies would help out like that. The smaller guys tend to be more helpful.

SuzyQ - I agree that would be a concern. Because I travel with my job, I pay $2 a month extra to keep my trash cans up by the house, instead of putting the garbage by the curb. That way I didn't have to leave my garbage/empty cans by the street all week long. I would think a municipal trash service could provide that, but I really don't know.

Njones60, you make some valid points, especially concerning competition for a city contract. But while I understand (and somewhat agree with) your reasoning that many of those who would be forced out of jobs due to the changeover, I think it is perhaps unrealistic to assume that all (or even most) of these people would go on to employment with the company that wins the contract. It seems as though the point of streamlining would necessarily be to reduce the number people employed in the local trash industry. This would have some advantages -- but not to those individuals who lose their jobs. I would not, though, call it "massive unemployment." I just happen to be a champion of the individual -- the "little guy" -- in most matters, so I think it's important to speak up for their interests as well.

As for customer service and Deffenbaugh (a company I have no experience with, by the way) -- I definitely wouldn't fault competition for failing to correct their shortcomings. We have no way of knowing how much *worse* their service might be if we didn't have the choice to use the 'little guy'!

At any rate, there are obviously many points of view to contend with on this issue, and there is undoubtedly much information pertinent to the issue that none of us has considered. I would certainly have to do more research on all sides before I could "vote" either way. I do, however, think it is wonderful and necessary to partake in a free exchange of ideas from all sides, so I applaud everyone for their participation in the "debate."

I'd prefer the city run it, but in order for that to happen, I'd need to have more faith that the city could run it.

Columbia has done it themselves for as long as I can remember, and they do an outstanding job.

Columbia also has their own power plant, and they still operate their own water company - successfully!

Call me slow, but I am starting to get very suspicious about what has been going on around here.....

Why is it so inconceivable that there be a recycling program that is not tied to the trash service? I am glad I live outside city limits and would not have to use the city trash service if they should make the unwise choice and mandate that everyone use the same company. And before anyone suggests it, yes I have trash service and no I don't have garbage museums or critter condos on my property. I'd like to see an independent, reliable, affordable recycling service offered separate from trash service. Anyone know of one? I think I saw it a while back on here that there was a small company in town doing that.

Deffenbaugh has serious management issues. They leave a cookie crumb trail that is almost unpreventable. They work their helpers to death. Most of these guys are throwing 7-8 tons of trash by themselves every day. It's a ton of work. they refuse to hire more help and if they take help when offered they have to take a pay cut for that day.

I have to defend them on this because their employees are treated like the stuff they throw away. I worked their temporarily while laid off and it is an absolutley brutal job. It's is by far the hardest, most demanding job I have ever worked. I gained a lot of respect for them. If they leave a small mess, no big deal. They need help. Take it from me, if you use Deffenbaugh, don't complain about the workers, they are some of the hardest working people you'll ever meet.